A Business Professional, with a People Concentration (Part 2)

Ryan Fortman is a Director, Human Resources Business Partner (HRBP) with the Go-to-Market business at New Relic. Ryan has over 20 years of experience in HR and is passionate about working smarter by using data and innovative thinking. 

Ryan and I continue our conversation about working as an HRBP and how to impact culture by using data to make change.

Jocelyn: You talk about this idea that the voice of HR is sometimes impacted due to the responsibilities of the position, how do you know when it is okay to speak up? Does this affect you being your authentic self at work and how do you overcome that?

Ryan: You know, at times it’s very frustrating, as HR we are the stewards of compliance and we have to be very careful but we’re also employees just like anyone else. We have the same frustrations and different belief systems and it can be frustrating because you can’t always express that. So sometimes you have to make peace with that, and sometimes you just don’t want to. It calls for a great deal of humility, patience, and you can’t be prideful. I have seen other HR folks that have crossed that line and it could put in jeopardy a lot of the things that we do. 

One of the things that helps me is connecting with my other HR colleagues because they understand our world and it is a safe place where we can speak amongst ourselves. If you have the benefit of having other HR colleagues that is one way you can do it and if not you can find other outlets outside of the organization. 

Jocelyn: Do you think there are companies out there that are more open to having employees talk about things like religion and politics and social justice where they can be their authentic selves and have those dialogues? 

Ryan: New Relic for sure, I have never worked at a place like New Relic. I feel like I can speak on topics authentically and it is one of many things that keeps me there. But it also makes it a destination for people who are often looked at as different, whether it be social difference, you’re a person of color, or different spiritual viewpoints, whatever the case may be. It’s a great place to work. 

A lot of companies are at a crossroads over these last few months over whether they were going to let people be authentic.

But that’s one of the biggest reasons I am at my company, it is because we believe that if you are your authentic self, you’ll do your best work. I believe that some of the companies that will embrace it, and figure out a way to also make it welcoming for all different viewpoints. Those companies will be in a better position financially and will attract top tier talent. They will look at all viewpoints as a way of making the company stronger and their offerings stronger. 

Jocelyn: I think that during this time of Covid and the social justice movements that are happening it really is putting pressure on companies to have dialogues they’ve never had before in the workplace. What do you think you would say to a company that has never done that? How should they approach it? I think there is a lot of fear there that they are going to do the wrong thing.

Ryan: Well the great thing about the time period in which we live, is you can reach out and talk with other professionals. In our organization, our executives have their own cohorts across the industry and one of the things I thought was really cool to learn, when everything was happening with Covid for example, my executives were able to reach out to their fellow executives and have a video call to say, “Hey, how are you approaching this?” It wasn’t about being competitors.

So one of the first things I would say is reach out and don’t be shy, and talk with other cohorts, establish some cohorts. 

And also, don’t sugar coat it. It would be a huge misstep for an organization that doesn’t take time to first have some dialogue and be vulnerable. State what problem you are going to solve and learn from other people before you make a step.

Jocelyn: Talking more about company culture, how do you think this impacts HR and on the flip side of that, how can HR impact company culture?

Ryan: I like to ask, “How does a person define culture?” I define culture as when I, employees, or my leadership are left to their own devices, what do they do, and what is allowed to happen? Now from an HR standpoint, it goes back to what we were talking about earlier. One of the things that I have found, and I am sure you have found this in your career, is companies have vision and values, but they are words on the intranet, they don’t harmonize with reality. At New Relic one of the things I really enjoy is that we are very deliberate in how we are trying to look at our culture. Because we have a certain set of values and if we believe in those values and the culture, the byproduct is success. 

Systematically there is a way you can look at your culture. One, you gotta collect the data. Not just engagement data. It can be pulse data, it can be a combination of things. I don’t think there is a magic bullet or single source. I think there is also a way to notice how a company is responding to culture to see where you can start to focus on it. 

A singular leader can be a magnet for culture but if that person is not present we ask: 

• What happens to the culture? 

• Will that essence of what that person promoted still exist if that person was not here? 

So I don’t know if there is a singular way of looking at it, but I do believe that you can’t get comfortable with it, you’ve got to constantly look at it. 

Jocelyn: You talked a little bit about doing a pulse survey and other data you can collect and I agree that you have to collect all different kinds of data to paint a true picture. What would you say, are your top focuses when collecting data? 

Ryan: There are three important things when you’re collecting data.

1. Benchmark the data

If I am going to collect data I would like to benchmark it to something, and what I benchmark it to needs to be able to engage and mobilize people. It can’t just be collecting data to collect data. So what I would say is you need to be very selective with who you partner with. The resources of a survey company prove they’re not all created equal and you get what you pay for. The return on investment to be able to unlock what motivates and engages people to think twice about leaving your organization is money well spent. 

2. Get Executive buy-in

If your executive management is not bought in and isn’t willing to hold people accountable, change is not likely. I’ve found it is better if executive management ties a goal into part of their financial incentives as a part of what affects their payout. I have found that will get their attention. You’d be surprised at how much you can help with that process because they are held accountable. 

3. Be transparent

Being accountable to the company for what you are measuring. Speaking to what you are doing and having that accountability.

Jocelyn: And when you talk about transparency, are you a fan of sharing the data that you collect with the whole company?

Ryan: Absolutely, at New Relic we are very transparent with that information and we don’t spin it, if there is an area that we need to work on, we’ll own it. And that’s okay, I would actually be worried if a survey was too perfect, when companies aren’t transparent and the next survey is just rosy or they’re just good enough to say everything is fine but then all of a sudden attrition says otherwise.  At that point you are blind to what is happening at your company. You have to be transparent but accountable and follow through.

Jocelyn: You are passionate about mentorship, tell me a little bit about how you have mentored people over your career.

Ryan: I love learning, I love teaching, and so if you work for me, I hire you because you have a specific skill set and unless it is going to put us in dramatic harm’s way, then I step in, but otherwise I let you make the decisions, and then you understand the why and it shapes your thinking. Then you are not making a decision based on me but you develop your own way. I ask a lot of questions, put some scenarios in front of them, and give them some homework. With our profession there are times where everything is fine, and then there is a crisis, and if you’re not going to be able to stand the test of that fire you need that experience. 

When there’s certain situations that put the right kind of pressure, I will put them in that heat, I will be close by if they need me, but even if they need me I’m not going to solve it all the time, I am going to help them to really think out the process and get confident in their skill sets. 

I have an employee on my team, and he wants to be an HRBP and right now he leads our practice in another area. So we have two types of one on ones. One that he owns, and then one that I own that’s about his development, and it’s about the business, understanding for instance, how do we get sales, what does our business do, what value do we add, why is this business so important, and then connecting the dots back to how it helps in our world. 

Jocelyn: I know you love working in HR and I am right there with you, can you tell me what you think is your favorite thing about your job?  

Ryan: One of the things that makes me really proud is many of the executives that I started to work with, to see them go off and be successful, as a result of our partnership, as that being one of the ingredients that helped them get to the next level. 

I have been really fortunate to work with a few executives that I have been able to be partners with and see them go from a Director all the way to a CEO. I worked with one executive that was a general manager that is now a CEO of a conglomerate and chairman of the board, and we still keep in contact today. 

I also like to see people who have interned with me who are now managers or professionals themselves, or people who have worked for me and that are leading their own departments, that is awesome because you had a part in helping them get there. 

Jocelyn: This has been great, any final thoughts?

Ryan: Keep pushing the envelope with who you bring on and what you do with your company because it’s needed. Who wants to do something that’s already done, I say break the mold and see what else you can accomplish.  

Jocelyn: This was such an awesome conversation, I know we could talk about our work all day. Thank you for being here.